Rich Frye

Because he has proven that things like science and factual study do not figure into Jelly's plan of getting hybrids into the hobby. Best to do these things back door, secretively , and without full disclosure. Simple.

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Please enjoy Fryebrothersfrogs.com

Knoxter

Jim,

Remember, "decipher the good stuff from the crap."

This is almost comical.

Also - This is supposed to be enjoyable, don't let it become stressful.

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Marc

My frogs- Vanzolini, El Dorado (ong&gold), Cayo de Agua, Almerante, Gold Dust, Yuris, Imis, Inters, Taras, O Lamasi, Iquitos Vents, Varis, SI.


I appreciate everyone here. Without you, there would be no DFF. Thank you for your support.

Rich Frye

Absolutely. Alway consider the source. If you have not enough experience to determine this, read on.



The problem is that there are just enough newbies who listen to what they want to hear, versus what is best for their frogs, their frogs and the hobby, and their frogs... that when these flashes in the pans get out of the hobby and sell all their hybrids to others who don't know any better, it actually creates lots and lots of stress for those of us left to try to help ID, put the newbies in the right direction, and clean up after the huge mess made by those who were not ready for single species dart vivs, much less mixed vivs...


Some take it a bit more serious than others. But the fact of the matter is we have more vocal mixers who now proudly say they not only mix, but create hybrids. This needs to stop and there needs to be people who can convey the gravity of creating a hybrid that has potential to screw up the hobby for decades to come.

Not a stress free thought, but true none the less.

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Please enjoy Fryebrothersfrogs.com

jimmy11

Come on girls settle down now. This isnt my first time to the rodeo. I never said anything about breeding these frogs I just want them to look at. So I am gonna get male to male pairs first and keep them in seperate tanks for a while and then with time I was gonna see if they would be compatible in a big tank. I was only thinking of putting 4 frogs together all males of course. And take it easy dont talk to me like I am your bIAtch. I doubt you guys would talk to me like this in person. Its funny how everybody gets all tough behind a computer. I am looking for advice thats why I came here I thought you guys would be cooler than the guys over at dendro board. And I guess you will always have your cool cats and then some @$$h@les. I guess there will never be a medium. Buts thats good in a way I get to pick who I want to listen to and who to laugh at. Thanks for making this kinda funny its always good to see a few feathers get ruffled. I just want advice so I can help the frogs. And again these frogs are not for breeding. So no more B.S. about hybrids or whatever thats not what I want.

Knoxter

To everyone:

Before you respond...

Unless you have information that may be helpful to the DFF community outlining the pros and cons of setting up a communal show tank with 4 male dart frogs, PLEASE DO NOT POST IN THIS THREAD!

The purpose of this site is not to ruffle feathers! But, to give members the advice and information they seek.

Jimmy - Each member here on DFF has different experiences and opinions which we use to derive our responses to your questions. Whether it is helpful to you or not is for you to decide. There may occasionally be some sarcatic undertones, but they are not malicious in most cases.

Regarding how you feel like you were "talked to" .... and the need to defend yourself is somewhat surprising, and in my opinion, unnecessary. If you have an issue with how you feel like you are being treated here on DFF, please PM me. I assure you, any issues or concerns you have will be addressed. I'm fair when it comes to handling the site. (even to people I disagree with, ask Jellyman )

Lastly, in the future, PLEASE be clear as to which member you are responding to and which of his/her comments you are addressing. It will help to recognize where the breakdown happened. I'm a stickler for clearity.

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Marc

My frogs- Vanzolini, El Dorado (ong&gold), Cayo de Agua, Almerante, Gold Dust, Yuris, Imis, Inters, Taras, O Lamasi, Iquitos Vents, Varis, SI.


I appreciate everyone here. Without you, there would be no DFF. Thank you for your support.

jimmy11

Hey dude sorry for disrespecting the site. With my tail between legs, I dont want to argue with anybody and I didnt need to post like that. We got off track. I am again lookin to put 4 frogs in a tank a big one at least 100+ But I am wondering if I could put one male to male pair of azueres with another male to male pair of tincs. I am gonna wait and see how they do in smaller tanks first as pairs then I was gonna put them together in a big tank. But again I want males so there is no chance of breeding and minimize aggression as I know females would definetly kill eachother. Has anybody done this and did they have succes. I am just looking for the safest way to approach this and I am gonna do as much research and reading but I havent seen anything such as I planned.All the other stuff pertains to hybridizing and or females fighting and not enough adequate space. I am trying to avoid all that. And again sorry I didnt need to post like that before. Thanks to those who are pro and con.

---------- Post added at 07:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:50 AM ----------

I m gonna start off by saying I know that rich frye is a really good guy with dart frogs and I dont want to piss you off cause I know I might need your wisdom some day with my frogs. And the first thing I was gonna do when I got my frogs is send fecals to your brother. I saw your website before I came to this site because I saw that quarantine is a big to do with dart frogs. See I was researching. And then I saw you on this site and put 2 and 2 together. I know you that you put in alot of hard work and time with these frogs and your experienced and your good at it. I can tell by how you write in these forums your passionate about dart frogs. But dude you gotta take it easy. I know you work with frogs, but you have to have people skills also, and show some social skills by being a little less harsh on the new guys to this forum. I know we dont know as much as you. But I think if you were more of a coach then a parent, then people might be into your info. I can take your criticism, but I saw how one poor guy had to defend over run on sentences. Come on man we are here to have fun and learn about frogs. And I look foward to your information, as I know you know what your doing with these frogs and you have been taking care of dart frogs for a long time. But dont ruin it for the new guys by being a know it all and rubbing it in. But I can take your constructive criticism and look foward to it some of the best advice I got in life was criticsm. I was also wondering what is the best way to obtain and send out fecal samples to your brother and what would I do to get it there since I am in california. Would I have to next day mail something like that or how does it work? And how long before I got results back? Sorry if I offended you but I needed to say it. I hope I didnt piss you off I would just like your advice since you look like you know what doing with dart frogs

Knoxter

Jimmy - I will say this. There are many factors that affect the climate of an online community. And the ability to CLEARLY express ones thoughts in writing IMO is the most important one. I truely believe that you can pretty much say what you want as long as your intentions are not to be a jerk, and what you say adds value to the community at large.

Having a Mixed Species in a Show Tank and Hybridizing or intentionally interbreeding your frogs are two very different topics. However, because mixing two different species in the same tank can result in hybridization the topics are often discussed together. IMO because you were not clear what your intentions were when you originally wrote your post, which was to put all males in you tank, you were misunderstood and possibly labeled as wanting to be "one of them darn hybridizers". See how that works? No harm, no foul. Remember, when you solicit help, you should be prepared to "get it" from all angles.

And yes, you are right, some people take this hobby VERY SERIOUS. Some take it way too serious. I love my frogs....they are my hobby...and I've been keeping them successfully for a few years now, but my life doesn't revolve around them. And I'm definately not willing to wage and online war for them. This is how I keep it in perspective. Some dog owners allow their dogs to sleep in the bed with them, and others keep their dogs outside in a kennel. Both owners love their dogs, but in very different ways, right? Neither is wrong, just different.

Your gonna get that here on DFF and any other site. Not wrong, just different.

Again, don't get caught up in the non-sense and decipher, decipher, decipher.

Glad your here. I will help however we can.

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Marc

My frogs- Vanzolini, El Dorado (ong&gold), Cayo de Agua, Almerante, Gold Dust, Yuris, Imis, Inters, Taras, O Lamasi, Iquitos Vents, Varis, SI.


I appreciate everyone here. Without you, there would be no DFF. Thank you for your support.

jimmy11

Thank you for clearing up this discussion, and I will make sure to be more clear on my next post. Sorry for the confusion.

Philsuma

Marc,

Just last night I rolled over in my sleep and almost squashed one of my vanzolinii that was sleeping on my pillow.

just sayin'

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Heading down to CR / Panama the end of Nov. PM me if you are interested in going along.

Knoxter

LMAO, I feel you.

Jimmy, pay attention....one down. Anyone else?

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Marc

My frogs- Vanzolini, El Dorado (ong&gold), Cayo de Agua, Almerante, Gold Dust, Yuris, Imis, Inters, Taras, O Lamasi, Iquitos Vents, Varis, SI.


I appreciate everyone here. Without you, there would be no DFF. Thank you for your support.