Carlos Pineda

Hey Philsuma wuz up! That was funny!! my wife and I were laughing. Now I'm having fun.

Rich Frye

Well Jimmy,
I'll do some more work for you. This thread touches on mixing. So do plenty of others, but you can get an idea of why it is not a good idea to mix any species, two, three ten males or not.

Mixing azureus leucomelas

If you read the whole thread you will read where I point out that there are many different pathogens which can come from different areas of the world. One dart from Costa Rica may have totally different pathogens than one from Surinam. It also may have built up tolerances to those pathogens those different frogs from around the world may not have, being that they had never before been exposed to that pathogen (until after you mixed them together).

Read Jimmy. Search, and read.

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jimmy11

So whats the point of quarantine? Isnt it suppose to catch those pathogens. Or is quantine not a sure thing and doent work all the time? I was planning on doing 3 fecals like you recommended. And then if my frogs do get sick then it must be the breeder I got it from. Not from costa rica. I wanted azueres and tincs they arent from costa rica. And how come you bring up worst case scenarios? Have you had your frogs get sick alot? Maybe I am not asking the right guy for advice if you have seen this often. And in those situations that you mentioned of cross contamination. Where they set up like I was gonna do with only 4 frogs with male to male pairs of azueres and tincs? I was still planning on keeping them quaratined till I got all the fecal results back. In seperate tanks of course. I feel like you keep bringing up worst case scenarios to scare me. I thought you would be more optimistic seeing that I am gonna take all the proper precautions. It seems like you dont want any new people in your little frog world. If thats what you want I will leave. I am gonna stop posting and leave this site if I feel another bad vibe from you. I have been trying to be cool since my first or second foolish post.But it seems like you are the dark cloud of this site and while your information is educational you seem harsh. I dont want to keep posting, only just to get knocked down by you. Thank you to everyone who has been cool to me and I hope to keep on with this site but I dont wanna get bashed everytime. So I think this will be my last post I hope more people will read and keep an eye out for others. Just watch out its not as fun as it seems. Good luck with your frogging people, And hopefully I will continue with these frogs despite negative optimism. Thank you for your time and consideration to the moderator and owner of this site. And rich a personal thank you for the info and ruining it for me good luck with your damn frogs. I hope they make you happier than when your on this site.

Rich Frye

The below answers your questions Jimmy. It (below) was in the thread I cited and suggested you read. But you did not read...
Page #2 post #15....
Sorry to 'ruin it for you'.


I'll throw some other examples of why it is not great to mix species/locals that would not normally even meet in the wild.

There are many, many examples of people from one part of the world coming in contact with people from another part of the world and shortly thereafter wiping out the indigenous population. People , humans, same species. Different locals. These non-indigenous people brought the disease they had become either immune to or resistent to a people (local) which was not fortunate enough to have the ability to fight off said disease.

There are many viruses, fungi, and bacteria that animals become either immune to or build up a tolerance or resistance to, if given enough time. Or, they may be lucky and be born with immunity.
In the previous posts I had mentioned that three clean fecals was a bare minimum starting point for testing. Fecals can find quite a bit of things from protozoa to worms to even bacteria. But there is plenty fecals will not find.

The testing needed for viruses to be both found and understood pertaining to dart health are all but none-existent. The testing for most bacteria is not done by fecals. The testing for most fungal infections is not done by fecals.

To round out my statement that mixed darts from different parts of the world are more likely to cross contaminate can be simply understood ;

I have a carrier dart with a virus, but not showing signs of illness, possibly due to resistance, immunity, ect.. Testing for said virus does not exist. It has not been an issue with that local of darts...yet...
I have a carrier dart from a totally different part of the world with a bacteria. Testing for said bacteria is only used when showing signs of illness. No signs, possibly due to resistance. It has not been an issue with that local of darts ...yet...
I have a carrier dart with a fungus...get the picture?

Now, I'm going to mix all three darts which have lived long happy lives on their own. What would the expected outcome be with this absolutely (can site example of similar occurences...) possible situation be? Dead frogs. All of these frogs went through separate quarantine. They all went through more fecals than most froggers send out. They all were watched for months on end. They all ate super duper . Active, happy, clean fecalled frogs from around the world. Dead.
This would not be possible if all three species were from the same local.
QED

Now, since I have pointed out a few cons of mixing for the health of the frogs, I wonder if anyone can point out any pros of mixing for the health of the frogs?
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D3monic

ugh...seems like every other thread on every forum turns into a debate on mixing or smuggling.

GL with your tank. Post some pics once you get it all straightened out.

Philsuma

Sad but true, unfortunately.

10% of postings are honest newbies or people with legit questions ect on those "flash" topics...

the other 90% that fight for their "right" to mix species or keep any frog they want, are pure Trolls or criminals (Sumggling).

Not just in frog forums but in all aspects of life.....ya gotta wade thru the idiots and B.S. There is no autobahn to bypass them.

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